Film Roar

It's interesting what the Oracle said with this sentence: "Now he [neo] lies trapped in a place between your world and ours."

At face value, there appears to be two clues here.

1) The Oracle refers to Zion and the Matrix as "worlds". Is this an indication that Zion and the Matrix are two separate programs that information can be crossed over into the over?

2) That Neo is trapped between the two worlds. Does this imply there is a third program that he's in, but thinks that he is somewhere else?
or,
Is it a simulation program that is being ran apart from the matrix program where the real world of Zion can't see him. Much like when Neo disappears from view when saws the "O" or the "A".
or,
Neo has somehow done a multiple "Smith" effect and replicated himself at some unforseen time, but will reveal this fact later in the next movie. This could allow him to remain in both the Matrix and the real world of Zion. He is neither here nor there, but in two places at the same time.

A thought just hit me when I typed in the initials for the Architect and the Oracle. "A" and "O"; Alpha and Omega? The beginning and the end?

Funny you should say that, Smith, in the videogame, says something similar to Ghost/Niobe

He says he is the Alpha to your Omega, the beginning of your end.

I think Smith wants to singlehandedly kill off the human race. Remember the first film, he really detests us!

or his remotely connected to the matrix not in either one but unable to escape

ps i dont believe zion is another matrix it seems to obvious neo puts up hand they stop hes in another matrix to simple dont u think knowing all the twists theve done dam good storyline

I personally believe that the Oracle's discussion with Niobe merely explains what we already learned from Reloaded. Neo is in a coma. He is in a coma because "he seperated his mind from his body" and "lies trapped" between the matrix and Zion.
In order for his mind to make it's way back to his body he is either going to have to find his own way back...or someone (Trinity) is going to have to go on a shamanistic journey to retrieve him from the inbetween world, limbo, or "hell" (as the Oracle puts it) that he is "trapped" within.

In the context of the story, I believe zion is a sub-program of the matrix or an alternative program that works alongside the matrix. How else do you explain Smith being able to cross over to Zion? And Neo, now has the same abilities as when he is in the matrix.

It maybe that this is all an imaginary story in Neo's dream or coma, but that has been done before many times (Jacob's Ladder for one).

What if there is no reality outside of the matrix? And Neo is just another program run amock?

NOTE: When the Oracle says "fight her way through hell" this is a reference to Hell Club.. a location in Matrix Revolutions where alot fighting with ppl dressed like the Gimp takes place.

I think this helps clear up the debate about whether the Oracle is "good" or "bad". She apparantly chose to diverge from her appointed duties of leading the One to his doom, and decided to help the humans instead (apparantly at great cost). This places her into the "good" category from what I can tell. Also, this conversation implies that the Merovingian is more important than he at first appears. "The Merovingian warned me, that If I made a certain choice it would cost me."

We can assume Neo is a bug inside the Matrix. If Zion is another program, running asides the Matrix, its single purpose would be to channel the awoken humans (the ones who made a choice). But, according to the Architect, the Matrix had a fundamental flaw due to this choice (Neo). If Zion would be another program, it should have a flaw too. May it be that this flaw is the trapping of Neo, or the transfering of data he caused by not resetting the Matrix?

It just suddenly occured to me....Well, I've seen a few theories that the Merovingian is an older version of The One, which is why i think: The Merovingian is refusing to be deleted, hence not letting Neo have the Keymaker. If Neo didn't have the Keymaker, he would not be able to get to the source, and, therefore, the Matrix may not be re-booted, so the Merovingian would not be properly erased. However, there is still the problem of what has happened to Neo when he stopped the Sentinels.

It's clear from reading most of the comments on this site that the majority of you have either been way too stoned while watching Reloaded or you just have overactive imaginations. The Matrix within a Matrix theory is really pretty silly and not at all supported by the script. This is a classic story of salvation and enlightenment. Isn't it obvious that Neo simply evolving and becoming "enlightened" He will soon be able to manipulate reality outside of the Matrix(like with the sentinals)using some heretofore unexplained metaphysical power. He is breaking thru the physical boundaries written into the "code" of the real world. If you think this is impossible try to remember that this is sci-fi-fantasy. Mr. Smith is, at the same time, becoming more human-like and will soon be able to "free" the machines. In the end Smith and Neo will fight but then ultimately unite against the Matrix and humans and machines will learn to coexist. Neo is the ultimate hacker of the status quo as is Smith. They are sort of the same charactor. The Architect miscalculates Neo (the 6th edition) and his ability to manipulate things inside and outside the Matrix. How does Neo manipulate things outside the Matrix? How did he resurect Trinity? Her physical body DID die on the ship, yet he still saved her.....? Neo's deep love for Trinity combined with several other factors has allowed him to evolve beyond the physical limitations that we AND THE MACHINES can comprehend. Hopefully this will be explained in Revolutions to some extent, but I believe that Neo will discover, when he awakes from his coma, that he has metaphysical powers even inside Zion and he will use these powers to defeat the Matrix. I really don't mean to be critical, but I think many of you would do good to apply the concept of Ockham's Razor: simple, efficient explanations are preferable, all things considered. R

The Merovingian is named after the dynasty which ruled the Franks (France) before Charlemagne (sp).

The Merovingian dynasty claimed to have posession of the Holy Grail, and be the descendants of a child Jesus Christ had with Mary Magdelene. The historical conspiracy theory I'm familiar with says that after Charlemagne made his deal with the Catholic Church (whereby the Catholic Church blessed his rule over France), the Merovingians were persecuted, and went underground. They then infiltrated the Catholic Church as the Knights of the Order of the Temple (Knights Templar), in order to "protect" pilgrims on the way to the Holy Land (in the period leading up to the Crusades). Along the way they came upon the Egyptian religion, and began to incorporate elements of it into their own religious outlook. After the Catholic Church got wise to what they were doing, they were again nearly wiped out, the few remaining Merovingians leading the remainder of the Knights Templar to Scotland, where they formed the Scottish Rite Freemasonry.

Hence, the Merovingian from the movie "loves all things French," is the "trader of information," has the "power that comes from information," and has access to the holy grail (the Keymaker).

Persephone, in Greek mythology, was queen of the underworld.

Of course, the simple explanation is that the program really did love all things french, and just took the name to point out how clever he was.

Persephone took her name, obviously, because she was the queen of the misbehaving programs who should've been deleted long ago (werewolves, vampires, ghosts, etc.).

They are both programs, because:
1.) The other 5 "Ones" had to merge with "The Source" in order to reload the Matrix.
2.) The Merovingian said that he had "Survived [Neo's] predecessors" (impossible if he has to join with The Source in order to reload the matrix -- the quote from Persephone was the he was "once like [Neo]").
3.) Naobi (in the game, Enter The Matrix) says to Persephone "you're not a girl, you're not even human"

Oh, and just for bonus points, the Masonic name for god is "The Great Architect".

Of course, the real point of the whole movie (given the raised fist [socialist/communist/anarchist] salute in Zion, and the appearence by Cornell West, African Studies professor at [IIRC] Harvard ["understanding is not a prerequisite of compliance"], and the various sayings by the Architect & the Oracle) is that the system cannot work *at all* without allowing some form of choice, so people are theoretically allowed to choose freedom over slavery. Even those who choose freedom, however, are controlled and twisted via ideology and blind faith (in this case, religion) into a simple regeneration of the same slavery. See also: USSR, China, North Korea, Cuba, Vietnam, Iran, Saudi Arabia, Afghanistan, etc., etc., etc.

It took me a while to get around to writing a review of The Matrix Reloaded, but it is now ready and posted at

http://www.geekroar.com/film/archives/000271.php

Here is the synopsis: It was fun and I will wait until November to find out what is 'really going on'.

Anyone have the Ghost and Oracle conversation?

I try to find what "amor fati" means. The oracle said that to Ghost... Please free your mind!

To Kalie, those of us who think its a Matrix inside of a Matris are stoned? Your theory makes much less sense then ours. Neo's powers lie in the Matrix and he can control things in the computer world. This is the Matrix not Lord of the Rings, there is no magic. Stopping the Sentinals with his hand? That is like me going outside and holding my hand out to stop a bus before it squashes me. Also not only that, but the other biggest clue where Agent smith is able to take control of a human in the "real world"

Also why would the sentinals not kill his human body? They did discover one survivor, its not like Smith could have made a deal with the other machines they don't like him anymore.

Anyways I think the Matrix inside of the Matrix idea is more viable. The only thing I didn't understand in the movie is why would all the humans in the Matrix die if Neo didn't help recreate humanity all over again in Zion?

Despite the countless theories that we all have, there are none that can be proven or denied as the simple fact arises that we don't know. It is rather childish for someone to name call others because their theory is slightly different than everyone elses, or to accuse people of being stoned because they think that there is a Matrix within the Matrix. The fact of the matter is that we won't know until Revolutions. Until then, it does no harm to believe what you will, but do not discredit others because their views differ from yours.

as for the Oracle, she must be doiong what she's NOT suppose to be doing. remember when Neo and her where talking in some playground in the movie? Neo asked how he could trust her because she was part of the matrix. Then she went on and talked about how when things are doing what they are suppose to be doing, they are invisible. but are seen when they are not.
Another thing in the video game the oracle said "the Merovigian warned me that if i made a certain choice it would cost me". Then if you go back to the movie when neo, morphius and trinity are at the table with the merovingian, he gets up to leave and say's " O and tell the oracle her time is over".
i'm not really sure who the merovingian is. as someone stated before, he probably is an older version of the one. remember in the movie when they are in the bathroom and Neo has to give his wife a kiss. well before that she say's "he use to be like you(neo)".
all very interesting to me. but as far as how neo was able to stop those sentinals with his hand and was able to feel them, also reviving Trinity.... Well i guess he is THE ONE.
my 2cents

good film waiting for revolution to find out what happens however you have to admit the way in which the game and animatrix all tie in with the film is brilliant never has there been or will there be a series like the matrix as to understand the plot fully you must watch and play everything to do with the film

I note several of you cite Smith's posession of the "real world" human as evidence for the "real world" being just another Matrix. While this would certainly explain the ending regarding Neo and the sentinels, remember that our minds, just like our senses, are interactions of electric and chemical signals. Smith didn't do the same old body take-over that all the Agents in the Matrix do; he re-wrote the human's mind to match his own program. This wouldn't be too hard, seeing as how a person loaded into the Matrix is basically an open source, with their brain and body coded into the Matrix for the sake of interaction; thus, rewriting someone's brain would just be a matter of modifying the code that defines them before they leave the Matrix. Thus, the "real world" Smith-human isn't really Smith, so much as a human brain with Smith's memories and personality, hence things like cutting his hand, as he would never have known pain.

I just posted a new update:

Film Roar: Egyptian Censors ban Matrix Reloaded

amor fati = fatal love in latin

What a mind-bending movie Reloaded was..here are my thoughts on the movie after spending half the night reading responses:

Some good questions were raised regarding Zion, I share some of those questions...if Zion has been destroyed five times previously and is real, it might not even be habitable at all...it looks like a pretty inhospitable environment for humans unless the machines provided the machines they use in Zion and Zion is the real world. The 'spare batteries' thing makes sense to me in a way, but on one level that seems very flawed, because the machines could easily set up another matrix in which to contain the 1% of humans who didn't accept the first matrix in the event that the first matrix failed...to me, Zion is a secondary matrix relatively independent of the first one and therefore technically not a matrix within a matrix. This might explain why Smith was desperate to get the codes for Zion- I propose that the machines, although interlinked in some fashion,have their own systems and matrices which can be 'hacked into', or rather two distinct networks which can be broached at times by programs in either...for example, Smith is in the first Matrix and finds a way to get into the second one...Neo is stranded between the two matrices. Smith might have control over the first matrix but not the second one, and as he is thirsty for power it makes sense that he would wish to have power over the secondary matrix also. I think though, in a nutshell, that Zion is also a level or another 'part' of the Matrix.
Let's assume that Neo is part or wholly 'machine'...he is the first One to experience love...now let's assume the Architect didn't want him to go through the 'save zion' door at all, and, predicting his emotional response, showed him Trinity to get him to exit back to the Matrix. Why would he have done this? Because Neo experiences love (and the A said that the process had altered his consciousness), what if Neo disseminating his code would lead to a shift in consciousness of the machines in which the machines would be unable to enslave humans becuase they developed love and ultimately end the matrix or at least have some sense of 'new era' between man and machine?
My guess is that in the next movie, Neo will realize that he is not completely human and is still stuck in the Matrix...he will 'imprint' his consciousness onto the machines as Smith copies himself in reloaded and cause the machines to evolve insomuch that they can't enslave humans any more. He might return to the source to do this and then, as predicted, the war really might be over. I think it's a nice 'love conquers all' twist.
Just my rambling thoughts:) Email me if you want to debate a bit,I don't think I could find this board again:)

I think its pretty humorous that alot of you think that Neo stopped the sentinels with his hand when he did not. After all was said and done a ship blasted the sentinels with an EMP...didnt anyone see the ship near the end of the movie?

Oh yeah, as Merovingian states to Neo "I have survived your predicessors and I will survive you", wouldnt that be totally f'd up since the Matrix has been "rebooted" 5 times already and the Merovingian should have forgotten since the reboot? That means to me that the Matrix has never been rebooted and each time the "One" has failed his tasks. Neo has never chosen the source cause if he did, the Matrix would have been rebooted already...just my 2 cents.

Although I´m open to listen to all the different theories, I must say I´m not convinced that Zion is another matrix. Just because Smith could get the mind of a human being in Zion (notice that the body remains human, apparently the same person) it doesn´t necesarily mean that there´s another matrix. Remember in the first movie, when Neo was being trained, they downloaded programs (to learn different fighting technics) into his brain!!! So, if that could be done, then it´s not hard to considerate that former-agent Smith, could "download" his program and overwrite the brain (or the mind) of this person that he took in the matrix.
Also, I think the Oracle really wants to help Neo despite what it would cost her.
Smith is going to fight Neo, but in the end I think they are going to work together because both of them will understand they´re looking for the same things. Remember their special connection...
Anyway, this is my humble opinion, and we all are looking forward to watching the third movie...
I really have enjoyed reading everybody`s comments, it´s very interesting how many ideas are born from this deep story, that makes us all wonder about our very nature, about who we really are, and above all, about why we make the choices we make...

TTBoy--You're way off. The Hammer wasn't in the area when the sentinals attacked or they could have contacted the Neb before the sentinals showed up or engaged them and . Plus, the hoverfleet ships use bullets as offensive weaponry (see "Final Flight of the Osirus"). Not EMP attacks, if that were the case, the hovercraft wouldn't work, they always shut down all systems before triggering EMP attacks, they don't fly into combat firing lightning bolts.
NEO is a program, the Architec told him, he was the 6th incarnation or the sum of the "glitch" in the system that is choice.
Whether he is human with the ONE program written into his neurological "code" or a complete non-human in the Matrix, which emcompasses both Zion and the actual Matrix--the Architect also said the one percent has been and always was accounted for and dealt with. The Free-Humans didn't go anywhere, they are still in a shunted off matrix for the 1% that con't remain in the Matrix that is Zion.
There's no way the humans outsmarted the machines...people aren't that bright. The human/machine war was a butt-kicking that we lost. But somehow the humans managed to escape and started pulling others out of the Matrix?
Not a chance.
It makes much more sense for the Machines to account for the 1% thru another Matrix than not. Plus if the machines have already destroyed Zion 5 times before and he was supposed to choose the "survivors" to reloaded the Matrix, then he would have to be a program or a human/program hybrid doing what he is meant to do. Even if he thinks he is not, for all he knows the Architect is pulling his chain or bluffing. If the Architect knows the Oracle and what to expect from the One, wouldn't he already have worked out contigencies for any choice Neo makes?
In the last movie Neo fights Smith who has taken over EVERYONE in the Matrix, but Neo will have to sacrifice himself to defeat Smith, unless Trinity and Co. come to the rescue. The very structure of the mainframe has to be rewritten in order to save the humans still wired in.

Hmmm, guess I shouldn't post while drinking. But I stand by most of my drunken rantings and typos.

My review of the Animatrix is posted at:

Film Roar: Animatrix (2003)

I think Zion and the Matrix are together "One Matrix". Zion represents 1% and the matrix 99%.
Zion, as many said, is a place for humans who refused to stay in the original matrix.

I think this clears many issues.

Something very important that everyone has to notice:
In the 1st matrix movie, the little chinese boy who lived in oracle apartment gave Neo a twisted spoon. However, in the 2nd movie and before Neo and his crew members take off and go to the matrix leaving Zion, another boy gave Neo that "twisted spoon".

Now think with me, how could a spoon in the matrix world (the imaginary world) reach the Zion world (the real world) ?
So, I think both worlds are one world.

Check out
www.matrix-explained.com

Apparently if the Oracle, the Architect and the Merovingian survived the reboots with memories intact, there exists a network that operates independantly of the Matrix i.e. the Mainframe. This controls the Matrix and Zion networks but functions on its own. In order for Neo to truly save mankind he has to find the bridge between the three realms and rewrite the mainframe code.
There isn't any reason that the Pure Programs wouldn't remeber the Matrix in all its forms, it would only matter to humans, who don't know the reality of the situation, specifically the Zionites, at least those who aren't killed when Zion is destroyed each time. The machines have no reason to care about the results of the situation. Although smaller programs like the Keymaker would need to be relaced each time.

The Reloading of the Matrix doesn't erase all of the programs that exist within the Matrix, that would go against everything the Merovingian said about surviving Neo's predecessors. That homeless guy from the game is still around, I think he is going to play a significant role in the next movie.
I just want to see Seraph rock and roll with those guns he had in his hands in the preview of the next movie from "Enter the Matrix"
I'd highly recommend everyone who hasnt played it track down somebody who has played the game and taped the live action scenes. Im sure there are those kinds of fanboys floating around.

Oh almost forgot--for those of you who think that it was an EMP from the Hammer that caused the sentinals to malfunction. Youre wrong: in the first movie once the EMP hit the Sentinals, they just stop functioning they don't static and jump and spark and twitch like theyre having seizures. They just fall over like in the first movie and in Final Flight of the Osirus when the captain zapped them.
EMP fry electronic circuits, they don't short circuit systems, just like in "The Day After."

I think that the reason Neo was able to stop the sentinel was due to the fact that he has evolved to coexist within the matrix and the real world simultaneously, so to speak. (and yes, I believe Zion is real). Somehow, possibly because he made contact with the source, he was left with the ablility to manipulate the matrix EVEN THOUGH he was unplugged from it (much like the former agent Smith can hold presence within the real world, albeit he's still technically in the matrix). He's in a coma now because his brain wasn't hardwired to handle that amount of juice all at once, but he'll snap out of it/be saved and master that skill just as he did all the others. As for Smith, I don't have a solid theory on that one yet, but I don't think that Neo and Smith will "team up," simply because they detest each other so much...I don't think humans/machines will coexist because of this...in fact, think of it this way...they are almost like the reciprocal of the eachother...a SPLIT ANOMOLY having a similar means to an opposite end.

Then again, I could be completely wrong, but it's fun to think about it, isn't it??

One more thing...

I think people get way too focused on the little things (i.e., the spoon)...don't take things for face value if at all possible. That's why drop those little things into the movie, to keep us guessing and completely off-base...it is those same little things that will keep us completely unprepared and soiling ourselves when we do find out the "truth" in the end. At least we don't have to wait another 4 friggin' years for it this time.

Let's see now... what is the matrix? a form of control. ow do we get control? avoiding choices. There is a matrix created by the machines which is planned to maintain the human batteries occupied for they can only render BTU's while they are alive. The machines have however limited knowledge of human history so they have to repeat a certain time loop that acknowledges their sway. But humans are known for not being satisfied with their life, so they try to escape it, the matrix has thus to maintain it's sway over those too or they may cause problems. It is created in this way a fictious world to where some humans may escape and run a resistance campaign against the machines, the human mind is this way occupied and does not try to escape further. Calling the first matrix "matrix" and to the second "Zion"; we have a first matrix for the simpleminded, and a second one for the restless. both matrixes have to reset but the first one was created by union of man and machine thus it is needed for the reset of the matrix it's human part: NEO. But there is a risk: if the real Neo does it's part the matrix shall be destroyed, so the machines have to create a replicant Neo to be awoken by Morpheus which shall make exactly what the machines want. We are now watching what would happen if the real Neo was awoke. Previously it was always the wrong Neo that united with the machines allowing the fight to be over, the finding of the real Neo and the resetting of the Matrix. At the end of Reloaded Neo gains conscience of the reality of Zion, believing that he can choose. As in the first episode he then falls into slumber while his system is assimilating the change, his real self that is. It is in this way that he is able to save Trinity, because he, like the Architect and the Merovingian is able to rewrite the code of the Matrix: that is the choice. That is why Smith is different, he is now a rogue program overwritten by Neo, or maybe this matrix has fled into Smith like a previous matrix which has crashed has fled into the Merovingian. THE Merovingian is a former matrix which has fled into the system and tries to regain it's position of power, that is why he has survived inside the matrix and Neo's predecessors, keeping attatched to the mainframe and not being a running program. As a result of the malfunction of this matrix the Oracle also gains a level of knowledge and starts malfunctioning, according to its reason for being, and misguides Neo, allowiung him to recognize the absence of choices, allowing him, so, to make choices. All characters recognize that this Neo is somehow different from the previous. When Neo is giiven a choice by the Architect it is a false choice, it is a choice between ending it faster or slower and bitterly, Neo chooses neither, that is why he is capable of autosubstatiating himself into another realm of knowledge. Understanding this Neo will return to Zion, will return to the Merovingian and by learning how to destroy him he shall learn how to destroy the Matrix once it takes refuge inside Smith, destroying it and causing a major bug in the physical mainframe which will result in its demise. What is missing is to know how many backup Matrixes there are, and how many wil Neo affect by rupturing the one in the end of the line, shall there be a domino effect?

one last thought: the architect is but a pawn while it keeps to its function

NEO: the human who will make a choice "because i choose to"
Morpheus: the one who awakes
Trinity: the one who binds
the Architect: the one who keeps things working
the Oracle: the bug in this Matrix, the prophecy is true it depends on the way you believe in it in the end
the Merovigian: a former Matrix trying to get back to the seat of power
Mr. Smith: the last resort

FULL CIRCLE: the story begins, it reaches its uttermost opposite and only ends when it returns to the beggining: NEO was in the Matrix, was awaken, now is reborn into reality, returns to Zion with knowledge and shares it, and finally returns to the Matrix to end his own FULL-CIRCLE.

I beleive that zion is inside matrix. When you rewatch the movie, the part where the keymaker, neo and morpheus are inside the room full of "hidden doors". The keymaker points at the door that morpheus has to go throught to get home. And in the scene were the keymaker is explaining to the captains what they must do to reach this room, he explains that the doors lead to hidden places. This places are and can only be inside the matrix, so zion its just another hidden place inside the matrix. We dont see link preparing an exit for morpheus. So they make us assume that the door is the exit itself to a hidden place( inside the matrix ).

Really interesting ideas have been posted.

The architect claims to know what decision Neo is going to make....but as a progamme he cannot understand why.

Merovingian talks about cause and effect which I think is possibly the main theme.

The machines can't really understand what would cause Neo to make the choice he did. Hence 'the one program' is designed by the machines to look at decision making process of a human (living) mind...why would 1 person gamble the whole of humanity for 1 other person.

The aim of 'the one' programme is for the machines is to become intelligent i.e. to understand/experience emotions etc..in effect to become alive. Neo is the real one because he has made the decision they wanted and through him they can become alive.

Ok, maybe I'm being simple, but I have some ideas as far as the Zion/Matrix reality question, particularly regarding Smith and Neo. Remember at the end of THE MATRIX, Neo realizes his true identity as THE ONE and attacks Smith by diving "inside" him. This action ends up inadvertantly "freeing" Smith from the restraints of being an "Agent Program." At this time, RELOADED arrives to continue the story. We see that Smith now has the ability to duplicate himself, because he has been "freed." He attempts to duplicate himself in Neo, reaching "inside" him...notice a theme building?

These two actions have somehow transferred the abilities of the human ONE and a machine ONE to each other. Thus, Smith enters a new realm, the REAL world, in human form, thanks to Neo. And Neo enters a new realm with the ability to "feel" the machines and control them in the REAL world.

If we want to look (again, simply) at the format of these films, in THE MATRIX, Smith and Neo face off in the Matrix...in RELOADED, they face off in the Matrix, but also meet in the "back door" hallway, and in the Real world. It seems likely that in REVOLUTIONS, the final battle will play out in the Real world.

Also, I question the statement in THE MATRIX by Morpheus:

"More important than what is when."
"When?"
"You believe it is the year 1999, when in fact, it is closer to 2199. I say closer to, because, we're not really sure."

Sorry if any part of that is word-for-word correct. :)

Anyway, my question is, can we trust that that year is correct? As we learned with the Architect, we're now on the 6th return of Neo. This reincarnation has lasted nearly 100 years. Is it possible it's a much later year than Morpheus thought?

Sorry if I didn't explain that so well.

One other thing from my original idea, about reaching "inside" someone else. Neo reached inside Trinity, after he'd been inside Smith and Smith inside him. So, concievably, Trinity has a part of both those entities inside her. This might be an explaination for her name, aside from the Christian overtone everyone expects...she is herself, Neo, and Smith. The beginning, middle, and end. Who knows?

So much to ponder...

~TRINITY

Jyotirmaya posted the Yoga of the Matrix on Film Roar: Matrix Discussion Slogs Geekroar which seems to have some pretty deep analysis of the Matrix themes. Check it out at:
www.members.lycos.co.uk/jyotirmaya

Ok I just finished reading the posts, and I realized something that helps prove Neo is a program. When Neo finds the Architect, he shows Neo the previous "Ones" (They all look exactly like Neo) If he were human, wouldnt the One's physical appearace change with each new One? There are loopholes that could get around that, like the screens behind Neo were playing simulated recordings of what the Architect wanted Neo to see, maybe to coerce him into making the wrong decision...I dont know. I only got to see the movie once so I missed a lot. I just thought someone else could take it from there :)

Anyone seen Wargames, because there seems to be a theme with the whole reboot this is the sixth matrix. Theoretically this could go on forever, but what if it was a test be the machines to see if there was any possible way of winning. It could still be 2199(or something) and the human nations are at the brink of war with the machines and the machines are playing tic tac toe to see if there is any way that there is a complete and final solution to there problem. In the end it could always take a twist like the one at the end of the first Men in Black movie. Sometimes people do things to get others going then blow it up in there face like the twilight zone. I just hope the next movies is as entertaining as the first two, then its on to the LOTR finaly!

Here are the thoughts of mine:
Well, first off I'd like to immediately disregard the "Dual Matrix" or "Matrix-Within-A-Matrix" theories from the start. Now this is not because either of these two theories are outlandish or stupid; rather, I just don't agree with them. I believe that the way, as the Architect tells it, that the machines handle the problem with the whole 1% of the people that don't accept the Matrix is with a very very real Zion. In other words, since they know they can't control everyone's minds, they set up something like a "Quarantine Zone" known as Zion where all the free humans must take refuge because there isn't any other acceptable place to inhabit on the planet. When he says, " . . . and therefore it is not beyond a measure of control . . . " I believe this is what he means. Also, I think that the scene where the "Keymaker" dies is taken incorrectly by a few of other "Post-ers". I think that it is being analyzed too much, i.e. - the "Keymaker" says, "That door there [Points to a Door] will take you home Morpheus . . . ". I think that this simply means that there is a "Hardline" for Morpheus to travel back to his hovercraft.
A second thought about whether there is more than one "Matrix": Well, the humans wouldn't be aware of it if it were to exist. Therefore, as someone mentioned the "Zion Mainframe", this thought becomes irrevelent since Morpheus and his crew are well aware of what it is. I think that the reason Agent Smith [In "The Matrix"] wants to break into the "Zion Mainframe" is to do exactly what is done about a half hour into "Reloaded", open the gates (This is of course because Smith is unaware of the systems of control being enacted on Neo and the rest of the humans).

Now another thought about Neo's newfound powers at the end of "Reloaded", I think that since the pair of movies has thus far had a deep religious meaning, that it's similar to the novel by Herman Hesse, "Siddhartha". The similarity being that Neo, over the course of the past six months, is attempting to achieve perfection of body and mind, a feat not accomplished by the other "One's". I believe that the "Prophecy" deals with this directly while it seems like a control on the surface.

Here's a third notion:
The "Oracle" names five renegade programs (Angels, Aliens, Ghosts, Werewolves, and Vampires) . . . there have been five previous "Matrix's" . . . is there a relationship there? Was Smith meant to be the renegade of this 6th "Matrix"?
And speaking of Smith, I think that in the park-type place where Neo speaks to the "Oracle", this is where Neo gains his "Real World Powers". I think that it's in the line by Smith, " . . . perhaps part of you overwritten on me . . . " [This in reference to when Neo "Destroies" Smith] Perhaps when Smith attempts to "Overwrite" Neo, the same process occurs and this is how Neo acquires the "Real World Zap-y Thing" or a connection with the machines. However, this is not very well thought out and not very well argued . . . oh well . . . but that's all I really wanted to say . . .

In the Enter the Matrix game, the Merovingian sprinkled something into Niobes mouth. It could be designed to do something later, like the cake he gave the woman in the restauant.

Persephone put different lip stick on before she kisssed Neo, could be like the cake, maybe that will have some effect on him later or it could have been the lip stick that kept his body working without his conscious mind.

Dear Naobi I just wanted to ask you were can you get your clothes that you wear on the Matrix for a low price? My sister wanted to be you for holloween.

THANK YOU

The theatricl trailer for Revolutions is now available. Details are at:

Film Roar: Matrix Revolutions Trailer Online

Wow some interesting ideas here.

But Merovingian being a former one? That would make him like what 500+ years old. I think that nullifies that he's human. Pursephone mentions that Merovingian was once like Neo. I don't think that makes the Merovingian a former one either. Remember these programs are have A.I. and have develop personalities of there own. They are able to think, reason the whole ball of wax and finally having their own personalities. Pursephone may of been just making a simple comparison of personalities. Cause although the Merovingian is a program is does have his own entity and is able to obviously make his own choices. The only part that I'm not to sure about is when Neo outside the matrix was able to stop the sentinels with...hmmm..whatever it was he was able to do. I'm sure that will be explained in Revolutions. But like someone before mentioned this is a sci-fi. So super-powers are not far fetch. It could be a simple evolution of the human mind to the point of where consciousness is able to reach outside the confines of the human body. Simply another level of being. Just a thought.

Now about Agent Smith. At first it through for a loop when he was able to get outside the matrix. But after thinking for a little bit. Is it really so far fetched? The matrix. A super computer that is able to collect the consciousness of a human mind and place it into a dream world to which almost everyone is oblivious. If the mind can be uploaded into a machine. As complex as it is. How is it so hard to believe that program can't be downloaded into the human mind. Remember Neo and the gang can have training programs uploaded into their mind. Neo and group can upload their human consciousness into the matrix. Going the opposite way and downloading a AI consciousness into a human being is...well.. based on the world of the matrix...inevitable.

A new post was made this morning for people who have seen the third movie and would like to discuss it. A review will go up once I have seen it until then a good place to ask and answer Revolutions questions is:

Film Roar: The Matrix Revolutions Discussion

The review for Revolutions is now up at:

Film Roar: The Matrix Revolutions (2003)

If Naobi did not die in the power plant in reloaded why did she and the others all drop dead?
Apparently it was not her ship that was bombed, Is this is the case?
Someone explain please!

Of all the words of mice and men, the saddest are `It might have been.

1 of you said somthing about niobe saying to phersphone your not a woman your not even humun. well before that.....phersphone said your not afraid to kiss a woman r u? but niobe wasint afraid she kissed her...... 2 times!!!!!